Darren

“We do not have to remove our shoes and put our luggage through scanners when travelling by train, yet, they are just as open to a terrorist attack.”

As 7/7 proved you may blow up a carriage with a large bomb and the rest of the train is not badly affected. You blow up the front of the plane with a small bomb and those at the back do not survive. Plus you have the advantage of maybe making the plane fall on others. Look at Lockerbie.

Is security that bad? 3 weeks ago I went though security at Heathrow Terminal 3, got pulled over for enhanced screening and was still was done in 10 minutes. 2 hours to waste in the shops/cafes which I think partly is the airports idea.

A question looking at this the other way round why is there no security at train stations?

Report this comment

I just find it inconsistent, recently I was through an airport scanner and none of them noticed my multi-tool yet asked me to get rid of my water.

Report this comment

I think the experience of going through security is often very humiliating and it seems to me it’s made so on purpose. I remember how for example at Newcastle airport I was already carrying my jacket, belt and lap top in my hands when the security clerk asked me to take my shoes off. Juggling all the stuff I was carrying to my left hand hand I tried to do as I was asked. Apparently I didn’t manage to do this fast enough because the security clerk felt the need to tell me to hurry up.

I wonder how someone who’s elderly or has otherwise mobility problems manages to do this without assistance. And in my opinion people who are just not as fast as they used to be should still be able to travel alone without assistance if they are otherwise healthy.

I think the security at airports is largely just security theatre performed to make people feel safe and has very little to do with actual safety.

Report this comment

My gripe is not necessarily with the process of security checking, but the manner in which it is carried out. My apologies for repeating myself – I’m pretty sure I’ve muttered about this here before – but, at the risk of sounding a bit like my mother in law, I don’t see why people have to be so shouty about it all!

OK, if I need to take off my shoes, to open my bag or to stand in a particular place whilst some check or other is conducted, then please, ask me nicely, remember to say please and thank you and somehow, try to make the whole process as civilised as possible. In return, I’ll try to do as I’m asked in good humour and be as co-operative as I can be. That way we can all get on with our lives as quickly and easily as possible.

TSA employees, I think I’m directing these comments at you (unless you’re at Albuquerque, where you already do all of this, thank you!)

Report this comment

I don’t object to security when i can see the point of it – we should always be on our guard against terrorism but don’t see the point in taking out laptops, separating liquids and taking off of jackets and shoes when the scanners can see through them all anyway – as a couple of MPs have recently agreed. Bin the out-of-touch rules, make sensible new ones as necessary according to the threat level and scan cargo more intensively.

Report this comment

Or think about the largest cruise ships, Allure of the Seas is just heading towards Florida and it can carry up to 6,400 passengers. Relatively easy target and that’s double the people from September 11.

Bringing down a single plane is quite small number of people really, i believe from terrorist point of view the targets would usually be more political — WTC was more about the WTC than the number of people, any big concert would have been more devastating.

Anyway, I agree about the security. It can and usually is ridiculous in Europe and especially North America. Travelling in Asia, Pacific and South America is much more pleasant.

Report this comment

I flew last weekend and forgot to pull my ziploc out at security. They ran my bag through twice, but that was it. No fuss, no nothing. This has happened to me a few times — and yet, I still have to hand over the coke I bought in the airport cafe. WTF.

The future of airport security is the past of airport security. So many people know this and don’t implement it because it’s not a showy quick fix. It’s the Israeli model of hiring highly trained and intuitive screeners to do a quick Q&A with boarding passengers. There are no machines, no body scanners, no taking away your sunscreen and soda. But it’s expensive, it involves a commitment to training sophisticated staff, not thuggish bureaucrats.

Report this comment

I’ve traveled in the USA the past months and it’s been an ordeal. Having to take off our shoes was pretty unpleasant (in Europe they won’t make us do it). I do think some of the measures are just too far fetched, but on the other hand I wouldn’t like to land on Empire State Building or god knows what other place someone choose to “make a statement”.

Report this comment

I found a very interesting post on pat-downs. Apparently refusing a back-scatter scan is not really on option either.

Report this comment

I think security people should consider the rationale of the precautions that they set especially the shoes and liquid thing.

Report this comment

Airport security has gone too far!! It’s more about more money than more security. Many head honchos from intelligence services agree that the body scanners, liquids rules, shoes off, laptop checks blah blah blah are all inferior to good old intelligence being effectively communicated to the airports.

And as people are saying, so why not have the same on train security etc??

Report this comment

Things I dislike – the silly thing with the 3 oz. or less liquids needing to be in a ziploc bag. Those bags can open and leak just like anything else – if you have your stuff in a zipped waterproof toiletry bag, it’s usually just as secure. Yet every day they confiscate in the hundreds of thousands. The invasive new body-scanning machines aka the “nude-o-scope” is the latest nightmare.

Report this comment

What iritates me is the confiscation of bottled water and then some airports have nowhere to buy more after security. As I am 64, I need to drink water on flights, in fact everyone should. Earlier this year, we flew out of Delhi aiport and I had a bottle of water in my bag. Security just asked me to drink some and let me take it . I presume that the idea is, if its OK, I will drink it, if it is some explosive additive, I will not and then they confiscate it anyway, or I drink it and get sick. Why do other countries not adopt the same principle?

Report this comment

I come from the part of the world where we live terrorism every moment – Israel, yet our airport security is geared that we do NOT remove shoes, if there seems to be a problem, there is a small “box” on which we stand, and we are cleared, or not. No belt removal, can carry all the liquids we want, no problem.

So, when in South Africa recently, and the airport restaurant carries a notice that only plastic utensils are used because of security, quite laughable since most airlines use metal utensils!
I believe that these methods were instituted by a group of people, in haste, without the vaguest idea of what they were doing, or the consequences. At Heathrow, for example, a small nail clipper was confiscated, yet one could buy a butchers knife in the duty free, and so on and so on.

At Tampa, women were stopped, before boarding and make-up confiscated, yet I carried a bag, fully visible, with bottles of wine.
Where is the logic? I could go on with regard to trains, busses etc etc. but you get the point.

Report this comment

Airport security is probably connected to tourism. They need to make would be tourist feel secure when visiting a country by making it harder for anyone to get pass the airport security control. As for the trains, it is usually use by locals who do not have as much money to spend on airplane tickets.

Report this comment

When I read Patti comment about cruise ship security I did wonder. I knew P&O scan luggage at Southampton as I had seen it, I also went though a metal detector. But I did wonder about other ports/ cruise lines.

I finally got an answer; while no company will go into detail basically there security has been stepped up since 9/11. Before it was a basic check to make sure you’re supposed to be on the ship, this has now been enhanced. Plus all cruise lines have baggage x-rays and security arches have been installed at key access points (passenger and crew), plus increases in security officers. It is not perfect but then comes down to what you need to cause real damage, as we saw during the Falkland’s war a ship (even older less safe ones) can survive a long time after being hit by an anti-ship missile designed to sink it. And that was not a military ship.

Are you at anymore of a risk than and hotel or restaurant from a smaller bomb? How far do we go with security?

Report this comment

When I read Patti comment about cruise ship security I did wonder. I knew P&O scan luggage at Southampton as I had seen it, I also went though a metal detector. But I did wonder about other ports/ cruise lines. I finally got an answer; while no company will go into detail basically there security has been stepped up since 9/11. Before it was a basic check to make sure you’re supposed to be on the ship, this has now been enhanced. Plus all cruise lines have baggage x-rays and security arches have been installed at key access points (passenger and crew), plus increases in security officers. It is not perfect but then comes down to what you need to cause real damage, as we saw during the Falkland’s war a ship (even older less safe ones) can survive a long time after being hit by an anti-ship missile designed to sink it. And that was not a military ship. Are you at anymore of a risk than and hotel or restaurant from a smaller bomb? How far do we go with security?

Report this comment